Over on my blog I have started a series called "The Real Man's Guide to Dog Training." The intent of the series is to use how and why I began a dog trainer as a way to explain basic training concepts, juxtapose them with many common myths about dogs and dog behavior, and hopefully attract some men to dog-friendly dog training.
In the first chapter I brought up the fact women far outnumber men in the dog training field and how I find this rather puzzling. This question was interesting enough that one commenter expressed disappointment that I didn't try to answer it in the second post.
Problem is, I don't have an answer!
He suggested one possibility: dog training doesn't pay too well and it is easier for someone in a household that already has another stable income to pursue a less lucrative career. (Before anyone hunts the guy down, he admitted it's a sexist argument.)
I countered that I know of many very successful women, some "famous," others not, that are running thriving businesses. I had some ideas of my own:
- All things being equal, a woman's body language is more dog-friendly than a man's. Most men have to work harder to be equal handlers while women became better trainers faster and are more apt to stick with it.
- Girls are "allowed" to be more empathetic than boys. This makes them more open to careers like animal training that may not pay the bills as well, but are ultimately more rewarding.
- Men tend to gravitate toward Cesar's style of training and his ideas. Meanwhile, more than 90% of the people that seek out dog training help are women, and they will most likely prefer a women's methods.
It's the first half of that third argument that "The Real Man's Guide to Dog Training" is trying to address.
Anyway, I want to put the question to the Dog Star Daily audience: why are there so many more women than man in dog training?
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why dogs are afraid of men
I won't dive into the sociological arguments--"do women gravitate toward jobs that don't pay well or do jobs that attract women become less well paid?" Or do men feel pressured in our society to take on jobs with a certain status or pay instead of "nurturing" jobs?
But here's an interesting piece I read on Patricia McConnell's blog with some recent research on the way men move: http://www.theotherendoftheleash.com/why-dog-are-more-afraid-of-men/. A study used a computer to analyze the movement of men and women when their joints were represented by points of light.
It appeared that the masculine gait was "moving forward" while the feminine gait was "moving away."
Dr. McConnell wonders if the difference in gait could be why more dogs tend to be afraid of men then of women. If her musings are right, it could make it more difficult for male trainers to help fearful and reactive dogs.
Pamela http://somethingwagging.wordpress.com
Qualify that statement
When looking for an answer you might also consider qualifying the statement "women far outnumber men in the dog training field." That is probably true in the pet dog training or even AKC competition events such as obedience and rally, but in fields such as protection and detection it would seem that men FAR outnumber women. There are starting to be more women who train their dogs in bite sports but there are not that many headtrainers (that I know of) at Schutzhund, Mondio Ring etc. clubs that are women. Also, as far as the most important trainer a biting dog will have, the decoy/helper, there are few women period.
why dogs are afraid of men
I was definitely thinking about Patricia's post on that. (Should have linked to it.) IMO many, many dogs have been misidentified as having been abused by men when they were just plain afraid of the way we tend to move. It was only with a lot of conscious effort that I (literally) changed my approach.
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Eric Goebelbecker eric@dogspelledforward.com
I think even if you add
I think even if you add those trainers to the aggregrate, you're still going to end up with a lot more women than men.
Protection work still uses a lot of aversives, which I think ties into #3 on my list.
Is detection work still dominated by men? Our tracking instructor at St. Hubert's is a woman, and the 2 women that put together "Nose Work" came from the detection field too.
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Eric Goebelbecker eric@dogspelledforward.com
men and women are differant
I've noticed that when training martial artists, there are huge differances between men and women. Let's assume we are training well adjusted adults, they are beginners and we are speaking in the most general of terms. Men tend to have pre-concieved notions about how to engage in combat and how to resolve conflict. These notions are oftentimes forceful, physical and unforgiving. Women tend to have differant methods of conflict resolution and are generally more receptive of instruction in this area.
When instructing a male to strike an opponent, if the strike doesn't have the desired effect, the male will often times repeat the strike increasing the level of intensity until it has the desired effect. If the female's strike doesn't have the desired effect, she will often times evaluate the strike and/or try something else. Generally speaking, escalation doesn't come naturally to women -but is easily taught.
Women tend to be naturally more receptive to non-verbal cues, which often times gives them a warning in the event of a potential conflict. This is often times a learned skill with men. Men tend to walk without much hip swing and with shoulders up and back while maintaining strong eye contact. Women tend to have a softer upper body position and sway when they walk, they tend to avoid eye contact until they receive a non-verbal "que" that it is appropriate. Huge differance. Men tend to punish unwanted behaviour, women tend to nurture. Men tend to confront a threat head on with an overwhelming amount of force, women tend to use a minimul amount of force, redirect and/or avoid the threat.
Positive reinforcement favors a person with nuetral body language. Trying something, evaluting the results and switching to something else, works better than escalating an ineffective technique. A socially skilled nurturer is more effective and generates more consistent results using modern training methods. This tends to favor women. Why? Because women tend to be better at reading body languge and resolving conflict by redirection, avoidance and reinforcement. Men tend to be more adept at resolving conflict by using force.
These are just some of my own personal observations. They don't apply to all men/women and are not meant to be offensive or provocative.
Using the Canon of Parsimony
I'd always assumed that many dogs were more fearful of men simply due to socialization deficits. Most people in the animal care "industry" are women: rescue, breeding, showing, veterinnary/vet tech, training, etc. Often times the primary care giver of a pet dog is female. So they are exposed to many more women as youngsters.
Chicken/egg?
I agree with a lot of what
I agree with a lot of what you are saying, especially about R+ favoring neutral language, but I would say that behavioral analysis and application prefers it, not just R+.
Although to be fair, women are just as prone to throwing out "extra" prompts as men – but they're usually "softer" prompts though and tend to cause less trouble.
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Eric Goebelbecker eric@dogspelledforward.com
Interesting question. But I
Interesting question. But I can't think of an under-socialized dog that favored men and was afraid of women. One of them would have to show up at least once in a blue moon, right?
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Eric Goebelbecker eric@dogspelledforward.com
You'd think it would happen but...?
I've never see such a situation either.
Every rescue org I know is female dominated and the few men I know that are very active in dog breeding have lots of women in their lives and that of their dogs. *shrugs* I've never met a pup that was undersocialized to women but not men.
I -have- met dogs that were generally undersocialized but even still, the people working with, feeding, etc were mainly women, so those associations might form more quickly. I dunno.
Clearly men and women are different but I'm a KISS kinda gal. ;-) Really interesting question though and it would be interesting if we find out that women might have an inherent advantage in dog/animal husbandry.
HI Ya...
I think it comes down to basic difference in gender.
Dog training 10-15 years ago was all about physical, punishment based methods...and the industry was dominated by men.
As trainers and training methods evolved to positive based training, I think men became less interested because, well, in their eyes it's "wimpy"
Broad generalizations there but men seem to think nature exists to be conquered where women have the viewpoint that human beings coexist with nature.
In any case, I am a very strong yet POSITIVE based trainer. There's nothing wimpy about how I train dogs just because I don't yank on chokers, physically abuse, or yell at dogs.
When trainers realize that being strong and being positive aren't mutually exclusive terms, then I think we'll see more male trainers.
John
Dog Training Club Survey
I found a snippet from a survey carried out in London in 1990. From the 200 results..
"In a survey, of dog handlers, 90% of males questioned wanted a male instructor, for females the gender of the instructor made no difference either way."
It's a statement I must remember!! lol
trainer preference
My mentor was a female. I'd assist her in group classes. There were times there was a male in the class that didn't respond well to her. I'd work with those men, usually there was an immediate change. Funny how that works. Occasionally you see the same thing with dogs. My guess is that with humans it is actually gender bias. I think with dogs, its probably the other persons body language is more suited to that dogs personality.
women in the field
Women have been responsible for the behavior modification, socialization and training of little humans for generations. Perhaps it's not that much of a stretch to apply that experience to dogs. Though I would venture a guess that the highest paid dog trainer (even loosely defined) in the country today is a man.
MEXICO
ClickerPetsMexico
Hi, Just a quick coment, In Mexico and most Latin American Countries the argumente that there are far more women trainers than men is EXACTLY the oposite, Here in mexico Men absolutly dominate this area. I am a femail trainer here in Mexico and actually deal with the fact that most clients espect men trainers, Maybe its all just a cultural question.....?????
Women
I just attended a dog behaviour seminar and it was my first. I would say 90% were women. I don't know why but it was the first thing I noticed. Kind of like why men dominate engineering type jobs. That's just the way it is I guess.
Specs Dogs http://specsdogs.blogspot.com
In Touch with Our Feminine Sides
I think good dog training requires one to be more feminine in nature, something I joked about in my first novel:
My female lead, Dr. Jamie Cutter, a forensic pathologist, is having an argument with her significant other, Jack Field, a former NYPD homicide detective turned dog trainer. She wants him to go shopping with her and he objects on gender grounds.
Frustrated with his argument, she says, “You know, Jack, it wouldn’t hurt you to get in touch with your feminine side once in a while.”
He counters, “I’m already in touch with my feminine side. It’s what I use to train dogs with.”
LCK
Male vs. Female Energy
Hey, Eric,
Thanks for writing this article. I came across it while looking up some info for an article I was working on for PsychologyToday.com: "Why Dogs Pull on the Leash, Pt. II: Gender Roles & Sexual Chemistry." What do the BP oil disaster, the root-seeking behaviors of plants, the collective movements of slime molds, the reason dogs pull on the leash, and the fact that there are far more female than male pet dog trainers in America have in common? It all comes down to sexual chemistry..."
Here's the most relevant section:
"Most of the male dog trainers I know of, or at least those who are good at it (in my opinion), tend to exhibit their feminine side a bit more when working with dogs. I think the reason for this is that feminine energy is in some ways more compatible with canine energy; that is, women and dogs are more naturally motivated to form emotional connections than men are. Yes, both genders have a drive to connect; but men are more driven to connect physically; to fix things, to make things move, to get things going, to build dams and guns and rockets, drill for oil and invent the assembly line. (While early man may have invented the wheel, at heart it's a feminine object.)
"[Dog trainer] Kevin Behan has said that dog training is about providing structure (masc.) and facilitating the necessary flow of emotion (fem.) that will induce obedience behaviors naturally. For too long the tendency has been to focus more on structure while ignoring flow. Hopefully, with enough female dog trainers, or enough men who are in touch with their feminine side, we'll reach a tipping point, and things will fall back into balance. (Mind you, I'm not saying there's anything wrong with masculine energy, or that female trainers are automatically less dominant or less bossy with dogs, simply that I think there needs to be more of a balance between the masculine and feminine.)
"This is important because dogs are not just our closest connection to Nature; they can also provide us with our deepest connection to ourselves. The more we learn about the real reasons for simple canine behaviors like pulling on the leash -- which has nothing to do with acting dominant or being positively reinforced (ideas that come from the decidedly masculine perspectives of Konrad Lorenz, Ivan Pavlov, and B. F. Skinner), and which behavior is more likely to be caused by an inner drive to connect emotionally to objects of attraction (which is more of a feminine idea, coming from Freud via Melanie Klein) -- the more we'll understand ourselves. And that will benefit both genders and both species."
LCK